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| | Rejected by Hell, again | |
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ravengrim Moderator
Number of posts : 7192 Age : 51 Location : At The End Of Time : : The Fallen Angel : : More Numbers : 7685943 Registration date : 2008-07-21
| | | | Vampira132 Moderator
Number of posts : 4606 Age : 37 Location : London 1886 : : The Victorian Woman in Black : : More Numbers : 7672840 Registration date : 2008-07-21
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:07 am | |
| From an Islamic point of view why the f*** would you wana go to hell?! You are tortured for eternity reliving the same kind of torture over, over, over n over again. Who would want that?!
Crazy B******* | |
| | | Guest Guest
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:20 pm | |
| - Vampira132 wrote:
- From an Islamic point of view why the f*** would you wana go to hell?! You are tortured for eternity reliving the same kind of torture over, over, over n over again. Who would want that?!
Crazy B******* Even from a Christian or pagan view, who the hell would want to do that?
Is it like their own personal search for Pinhead or something? |
| | | La Diva Carlotta supernova
Number of posts : 7864 Age : 44 Location : New York City : : More Numbers : 7584553 Registration date : 2008-07-23
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:29 pm | |
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| | | deadcoldgothgirl supernova
Number of posts : 6332 Age : 34 Location : Roseville MI : : More Numbers : 7582379 Registration date : 2008-07-24
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Sat Sep 17, 2011 2:10 pm | |
| I don't understand some people and why they would want to do that. Hell is supposed to be the place of pure evil and torture. Anyone would want to put themselves through that because? | |
| | | Spooky vip member
Number of posts : 1421 Age : 42 Location : Exit 11: New Jersey : : More Numbers : 7573423 Registration date : 2008-07-28
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:46 pm | |
| I just had a debate about this is my philosophy class, and now I have to bring up some of my arguments. For hell is just such a flawed and absurd idea, it simply doesn't fit with the bulk of teaching in any of the Abrahamic faiths.
There's this core argument about the identity of Hell, which it exists because God has infinite dignity, which means that any transgression against him (male driven monolithic faiths) warrants an infinite punishment to the sinner. Not every sin is against God, but technically any sin against another person is against God since he created all things and is all things. But by definition an omnipotent being, is incapable of being harmed, so condemning souls to eternal damnation, is God punishing souls for crimes that had no effect on him.
The Jewish, Muslim and Christian God is described as omnipotent and perfect, all knowing and responsible of all things that have ever been and will ever be. So aside from the fact that this perfect entity, is also a jealous prick who flies off into a rage and kills and punishes people when he isn't shown love and attention; this all knowing God is aware of any and all transgressions by sinners before they make them. When God was creating the universe, he knew then, that right now as you read this, there is some man raping and killing a child in some war-torn African country. God knew it was going to happen; he knows everything and did nothing to stop it. He created the rapist and murderer knowing what he'd do, created the child knowing what would happen to her; and is going to let her die horribly and wait til death eventually takes the perpetrator of the crime to punish him well after the fact. Why would this God create a child simply to die horribly, why would he not save her, why would he not interject his power to stop the rapist and murderer? But more importantly asked is this; if God knows everything that will ever happen, freewill isn't possible, so how can God be surprised and offended by anyone's sins? God knew when Adam first named all the animals that you were going to take his name in vain last week, he knows everything destined to ever happen, so why must he torture all non-grovelling sinners forever. Couldn't God have done something about Hitler, Khomeini, Ivan the Terrible, Stalin, Pol Pot, Idi Amin and countless other men responsible for genocide, including many of his servant Popes and Ayatollahs? Doesn't some blame reasonably fall upon those who willfully allow terrible things happen, and if so, why isn't God held accountable for knowing all the horrors being done, have been done, and will ever be done, and doing nothing about it until after the fact?
Muslims believe that humans are born with a natural belief in God, that their casting into hell is because either their bad deeds outweigh their good deeds, or they willfully refuse belief in Allah. Getting into heaven is due to Allah rewarding you with his forgiveness and going to hell requires a person to pass a series of gates, asking the keepers of the gates if there are any messages from God for them. There are all these convoluted aspects of everything being predetermined from the very beginning of all things that makes that idea of freewill or shocking God so strained, that God seems more and more like a petty little brat than anything else.
Christianity, and all the countless branches of that faith, have a ton of different beliefs and ideals, but most teach that Hell is governed over by demons and ultimately the Devil. Why would the enemy of God torture humans like him, who turned away from God, why is the Devil who he himself allowed to be and predestined of all actions, willfully be God's task master and torturer of sinners?
John 4:16 states: "God is Love"
Corinthians states: "Love is patient, love is kind, and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things."
If God is Love, and Love are all those things, a problem arises. If Love/God "does not take into account a wrong suffered"; then God doesn't hold anything done wrong against a person, and therefore, is incapable of punishing someone for what they've done no matter how terrible. A patient, kind, non-jealous God that does not keep track of any bad deeds, would not send anyone to hell; for that matter hell would have no reason to exist at all. | |
| | | Guest Guest
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:13 pm | |
| ^^^The whole "omnipotent, all knowing" bit is a load that was created in the recent past. So depending on how far back, he wouldn't have known... if one even believes what is written in that messed up book.
You know, maybe the author just didn't know what they were doing and they weren't actually looking for the Christian/whatever hell? They could have easily told the person that they were searching for Hel (as in, the goddess of the Germanic Pagan underworld Helheim) and they misunderstood it. Helheim is the place that souls go if they didn't do anything particularly awesome in their life or they were retched their whole life.
If I remember right, the actual word for hell in the bible is actually supposed to be Sheol or something like that0.
EDIT: Also, this story is from Malaysia. How do we know what religion/myth system they're talking about? |
| | | Ginger_Snaps Moderator
Number of posts : 4545 Age : 36 Location : The Otherworld : : Werewolf : : More Numbers : 7583589 Registration date : 2008-07-22
| Subject: Re: Rejected by Hell, again Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:22 pm | |
| To me, Heaven is Hell--namely the Christian one. | |
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